Jump to content

What goes around comes around Carolina pay back Kotkaniemi offer sheet


Habsfan89
 Share

Recommended Posts

Wow eh, I'm kinda surprised they let kk walk.

 

I honestly always thought it was dumb that the Habs drafted him in the 1st place, when Tkachuk was unarguably the better choice. 

 

Silly question, but did the compensation change?  I always thought that the team losing the player would get 2 1sts and a 2nd or possibly 3rd rnd pick vs 1 1st and 1 3rd.  That compensation doesn't seem like enough.  ex:  what GM wouldnt give up a 1st rnd pick + a 3rd rnd pick thats placed 10th-30th to steal a top 5 pick from another team?

 

Oh well, it will a lot of fun to watch Gally beat the crap out of kk every time the Habs face the Canes. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Sir_Boagalott said:

Wow eh, I'm kinda surprised they let kk walk.

 

I honestly always thought it was dumb that the Habs drafted him in the 1st place, when Tkachuk was unarguably the better choice. 

 

Silly question, but did the compensation change?  I always thought that the team losing the player would get 2 1sts and a 2nd or possibly 3rd rnd pick vs 1 1st and 1 3rd.  That compensation doesn't seem like enough.  ex:  what GM wouldnt give up a 1st rnd pick + a 3rd rnd pick thats placed 10th-30th to steal a top 5 pick from another team?

 

Oh well, it will a lot of fun to watch Gally beat the crap out of kk every time the Habs face the Canes. 

 

Here you go

 

https://thewincolumn.ca/2021/07/02/nhl-announces-2021-offer-sheet-compensation-tiers/

 

 

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I’m ok with this. I said in a previous post, the Habs weakness wasn’t just that it was unproven centers but the ages of all of them. Suzuki is untouchable, Evans is affordable. Paquette is serviceable on the 4th line. The issue was KK as second line C and no one to insulate anyone else. 
 

we have a hole, but I’m not sure we didn’t have a hole even with KK - we had hope, but that’s it. 
 

If we can get a 30ish 2nd line C for 6m or less, we are actually better off for next season than with KK. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

Ah, ok, that makes more sense.  Thanks for that link.  That confused me because I always thought it was more compensation, but it goes by player salary.  However, the compensation should probably also take into account draft position too. 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've had two Montreal jerseys over the years.  The first was Cammalleri who was traded just a few months after I got it.  The second was Kotkaniemi who is now gone less than a year after I got it.  Who do you want gone next?  At this point, I'm taking suggestions (and donations) for the next one. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, dlbalr said:

I've had two Montreal jerseys over the years.  The first was Cammalleri who was traded just a few months after I got it.  The second was Kotkaniemi who is now gone less than a year after I got it.  Who do you want gone next?  At this point, I'm taking suggestions (and donations) for the next one. 

 

Carey?

 

*hides*

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, dlbalr said:

I've had two Montreal jerseys over the years.  The first was Cammalleri who was traded just a few months after I got it.  The second was Kotkaniemi who is now gone less than a year after I got it.  Who do you want gone next?  At this point, I'm taking suggestions (and donations) for the next one. 

 

Ouch. That's why the only name/number I've gotten on a jersey was a replica Columbus Chill jersey earlier this year, with number 33 and the name "Mad Cows".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, dlbalr said:

I've had two Montreal jerseys over the years.  The first was Cammalleri who was traded just a few months after I got it.  The second was Kotkaniemi who is now gone less than a year after I got it.  Who do you want gone next?  At this point, I'm taking suggestions (and donations) for the next one. 


Bergevin 

 

get two so he can be gone faster…

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, dlbalr said:

I've had two Montreal jerseys over the years.  The first was Cammalleri who was traded just a few months after I got it.  The second was Kotkaniemi who is now gone less than a year after I got it.  Who do you want gone next?  At this point, I'm taking suggestions (and donations) for the next one. 


You’ve probably heard me say this before, but when shilling out for a jersey your best bet is a retired great. I’d only take current player if their iconic/historic status is already secured, e.g., Price.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

You’ve probably heard me say this before, but when shilling out for a jersey your best bet is a retired great. I’d only take current player if their iconic/historic status is already secured, e.g., Price.

 

I should clarify both were gifts where I had no say in the matter.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 minutes ago, Zowpeb said:

Bergevin 

 

get two so he can be gone faster…

 

I'm not sure I've ever seen a jersey with a GM's name on it over the years.  That'd be a bit of collectable I guess.

 

On a different note, any interest in rejoining the SK league this season?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, tomh009 said:

I would have liked to keep him. But he's not worth $6M on a one-year RFA contract.

 

We move on. Waiting for your next move, M. Bergevin!

I think we should matched, and there was no reason to rush a trade.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have to say I am quite disappointed with the decision to let him walk. Obviously I believed in KK to develop into an impact player. As a third overall pick I trusted that the team had done their due diligence in drafting the player.  From what I observed he was showing great promise, namely his hockey IQ and what I considered a strong performance from such a young player in the playoffs. Maybe this was poor drafting, maybe this was the team rushing a young player. Personally I do subscribe to the idea that 99% of the time teenagers should not play in the NHL. There is a big difference between 18 and 20 and very few players development has been hampered by leaving them in the minors too long. Another possibility is that the relationship between KK and management had degraded to the point that his exit was simply a matter of time. Regardless of the reason, I think it would be pretty difficult for management to defend their asset management in this case. You don't want to be put in such a terrible and awkward loose loose position with such a young and promising asset. The kid is only 21 and there is such a wide range of potential outcomes his development could take. Bottom line, I don't like how the whole situation unfolded and from what the outside appears to be hard headedness from the general manager is quite concerning.  It makes it hard to cheer for this team when promising young players are consitantly not meeting team / media created expectations or leaving. All this said, I though Galchenyuk was on the cusp of breaking out as well.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, sim.on said:

I have to say I am quite disappointed with the decision to let him walk. Obviously I believed in KK to develop into an impact player. As a third overall pick I trusted that the team had done their due diligence in drafting the player.  From what I observed he was showing great promise, namely his hockey IQ and what I considered a strong performance from such a young player in the playoffs. Maybe this was poor drafting, maybe this was the team rushing a young player. Personally I do subscribe to the idea that 99% of the time teenagers should not play in the NHL. There is a big difference between 18 and 20 and very few players development has been hampered by leaving them in the minors too long. Another possibility is that the relationship between KK and management had degraded to the point that his exit was simply a matter of time. Regardless of the reason, I think it would be pretty difficult for management to defend their asset management in this case. You don't want to be put in such a terrible and awkward loose loose position with such a young and promising asset. The kid is only 21 and there is such a wide range of potential outcomes his development could take. Bottom line, I don't like how the whole situation unfolded and from what the outside appears to be hard headedness from the general manager is quite concerning.  It makes it hard to cheer for this team when promising young players are consitantly not meeting team / media created expectations or leaving. All this said, I though Galchenyuk was on the cusp of breaking out as well.

 

Agree with much of your post. If they hadn't left him here as an 18 year old then we wouldn't be having this discussion as he wouldn't have been an RFA. He also would have been farther along in his development before he got to be an RFA and the decision to match or let him walk would have been made with better information. It was a bad situation all around and the Habs were in a vulnerable position. I hope they learned something from this. DON"T rush 18 year old kids. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, sim.on said:

I have to say I am quite disappointed with the decision to let him walk. Obviously I believed in KK to develop into an impact player. As a third overall pick I trusted that the team had done their due diligence in drafting the player.  From what I observed he was showing great promise, namely his hockey IQ and what I considered a strong performance from such a young player in the playoffs. Maybe this was poor drafting, maybe this was the team rushing a young player. Personally I do subscribe to the idea that 99% of the time teenagers should not play in the NHL. There is a big difference between 18 and 20 and very few players development has been hampered by leaving them in the minors too long. Another possibility is that the relationship between KK and management had degraded to the point that his exit was simply a matter of time. Regardless of the reason, I think it would be pretty difficult for management to defend their asset management in this case. You don't want to be put in such a terrible and awkward loose loose position with such a young and promising asset. The kid is only 21 and there is such a wide range of potential outcomes his development could take. Bottom line, I don't like how the whole situation unfolded and from what the outside appears to be hard headedness from the general manager is quite concerning.  It makes it hard to cheer for this team when promising young players are consitantly not meeting team / media created expectations or leaving. All this said, I though Galchenyuk was on the cusp of breaking out as well.

 

KK was badly mismanaged. You’re right. There was absolutely no developmental reason to bring him up that soon - that he was in and out of the lineup for two years proves this - and all we did was burn his entry level contract and make possible the predatory offer-sheet. 

 

Whether he should have been drafted in the first place is a whole other story. And it’s still too soon to tell. Will he become Eller 2.0 or a lower-rent version of Kopitar? Beats me, but the fact that he seems to have felt entitled to a roster spot and blames the coaches for not having one definitely bothers me. Also, I didn’t see this tremendous hockey sense from the kid. What I saw was one of those guys who looks pretty good when he plays a physical, north-south game, but who seems to consistently default to not playing that game. If he is resistant to coaching and correction, then that increases the probability that he will never really max out that potential.

 

Which is a further strike against bringing him up so soon. If KK is entitled, why is that? Surely it’s in part because he was handed an NHL job without earning it.

 

7 hours ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

Agree with much of your post. If they hadn't left him here as an 18 year old then we wouldn't be having this discussion as he wouldn't have been an RFA. He also would have been farther along in his development before he got to be an RFA and the decision to match or let him walk would have been made with better information. I hope they learned something from this. DON"T rush 18 year old kids. 

 

Amen! Trouble is, I think PR plays a huge role in those decisions. It may not be a coincidence that both Mete and KK were thrown in very young at a time when the Habs sucked and the organization was taking a lot of heat. It’s a bait and switch: “Hey, look over there! Don’t look at our actual performance, look at the (supposed) potential of these great young stars!!” And sure enough, the fans bought in 100% and the boards lit up with gushing about how the future is bright, etc., etc..

 

Call me cynical.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

KK was badly mismanaged. You’re right. There was absolutely no developmental reason to bring him up that soon - that he was in and out of the lineup for two years proves this - and all we did was burn his entry level contract and make possible the predatory offer-sheet. 

 

Whether he should have been drafted in the first place is a whole other story. And it’s still too soon to tell. Will he become Eller 2.0 or a lower-rent version of Kopitar? Beats me, but the fact that he seems to have felt entitled to a roster spot and blames the coaches for not having one definitely bothers me. Also, I didn’t see this tremendous hockey sense from the kid. What I saw was one of those guys who looks pretty good when he plays a physical, north-south game, but who seems to consistently default to not playing that game. If he is resistant to coaching and correction, then that increases the probability that he will never really max out that potential.

 

Which is a further strike against bringing him up so soon. If KK is entitled, why is that? Surely it’s in part because he was handed an NHL job without earning it.

 

 

Amen! Trouble is, I think PR plays a huge role in those decisions. It may not be a coincidence that both Mete and KK were thrown in very young at a time when the Habs sucked and the organization was taking a lot of heat. It’s a bait and switch: “Hey, look over there! Don’t look at our actual performance, look at the (supposed) potential of these great young stars!!” And sure enough, the fans bought in 100% and the boards lit up with gushing about how the future is bright, etc., etc..

 

Call me cynical.

 

Agree 100%, people and media were enamored with him when he was 18  and that increased pressure on the Habs to keep him up which was a big mistake. Then by the time he is 20 he thinks he should play every playoff game.  The Habs messed up his development and it cost them.  At least with Caulfield and Suzuki we will have a much better idea what their ceiling is before they become RFA's, with KK we were just guessing. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

that first season, Kotkaniemi was the best centre available to play 3C in the NHL. McCarron, Audette, Weal were still around. deLaRose lost to waivers. Thompson could not have played 3C

 

Habs were stuck, and MB decided not to trade prospects to improve the team. Prospect that at the time included Suzuki, Poehling, Romanov, Norlinder

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...