Trade Deadline and the Habs

[Plutarch]

The NHL trade deadline is March 21st.

As of today that's 99 days away.

By then 64 games will be played (35 left to play).

Price, Edmonston and Byron will be back in January... Toffoli will be back by the start of March or late February. Basically we should have a much fuller roster and therefore can actually trade people without calling up Cameron Hillis or Fairbrother lol.

 

As people have covered... Players with term are more likely to be traded/get a better return in the offseason. Leaving the expiring contracts.

 

Expiring contracts: 

UFA

LD - Ben Chiarot - 3.5M

LD - Brett Kulak - 1.85M

F - Cedrick Paquette - 950k

F - Matthieu Perreault - 950k

RD - Chris Wideman - 750k

 

RFA

W - Artturri Lehkonen - 2.3M

LD - Sami Niku - 750k

 

There are more but I figure they have no value ie: Clague, Pezzeta types or and I figure we aren't trading Romanov.

 

Questions I have:

Has Wideman shown enough to have value for a depth d?

 

What value does Kulak hold... In particular are there any more analytically minded teams in need of d?

 

How is Chiarot on his right side?

 

Would anyone trade a 7th for a Perreault?

 

What does Lehkonen's RFA + Arbitration rights do to his value?

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

This will be a busy topic. My thoughts;

 

Chiarot  - easily gets a 1st round pick plus depending on how desperate some teams are to win, many will be interested

Kulak - a good depth defenseman, likely a 5th round pick

Wideman - maybe a 6th or 7th round pick

Perreault - definitely has value, they will do better than a 7th

Lehkonen - would not trade him for anything less than a 2nd, I really like Lehkonen, has more value on a good team

 

Other players with term will likely be a summer time decision although I see some teams taking a long look at Toffoli assuming he is healthy. 

 

I definitely see the Oilers as a trading partner, they have lost 5 in a row and there is huge pressure to win this year.  Is their defense and goaltending good enough?  I would love to pry Philip Broberg from the Oilers or a Dylan Holloway. 

 

 

[Habsfan89]

Trade ufa's and RFA you don't want to resign get picks for them.

 

Big name trades would probably be done at the draft or before free agency starts. 

[GHT120]

38 minutes ago, Plutarch said:

... Questions I have:

Has Wideman shown enough to have value for a depth d?

Looking at some guys the habs have traded for over the years ... absolutely.

 

What value does Kulak hold... In particular are there any more analytically minded teams in need of d?

Teams ALWAYS are looking for defencemen at the deadline, apparently "you can't have enough" ... unless the buyers ugly outweigh the available D I expect a 4th at best

 

How is Chiarot on his right side?

He has played it some, and better than I expected ... but don't know if he has played it enough, and well enough, to add any value

 

Would anyone trade a 7th for a Perreault?
Bergeron gave up a 6th for Steve Ott ... so maybe better than a 7th

 

What does Lehkonen's RFA + Arbitration rights do to his value?

RFAs (arbitration or not) are effectively UFAs for whom a teams have a right of first refusal ... so don't know that it detracts at all, and may add a tiny bit if the team sees him in their plans down the road.

 

See above

[TurdBurglar]

Chiarot is going to be gone before or at the deadline.  I think the interesting ones are going to be the rumours of Gallagher and Toffoli.  These 2 could get decent returns if moved.  

[dlbalr]

I don't see Gallagher moving.  He wasn't playing well enough to draw much interest and that was coming off the heels of what was a pretty poor playoff performance.  Name value counts for something but that's trumped by five more years on an above-market contract.  His value is minimal at best.  Toffoli, on the other hand, has a good contract and as long as he's able to come back without an issue, he should get some interest although an offseason trade is likelier when it's easier to move money.

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

1 hour ago, dlbalr said:

I don't see Gallagher moving.  He wasn't playing well enough to draw much interest and that was coming off the heels of what was a pretty poor playoff performance.  Name value counts for something but that's trumped by five more years on an above-market contract.  His value is minimal at best.  Toffoli, on the other hand, has a good contract and as long as he's able to come back without an issue, he should get some interest although an offseason trade is likelier when it's easier to move money.

 

I agree, I don't seem much interest in Gallagher unless the Habs eat some of his salary which for 5 years is not enticing. I think many teams looking for added scoring would show interest in Toffoli, pretty good value at 4.5 and only 2 more years. 

[Neech]

I wonder what value Anderson could fetch on the market.  We have too many RW's and he might be the only one who could return us some positive future assets.  But once again, the crazy term will make it much more difficult to move him.  I think we might find that we're locked into Bergy's unbalanced team for the long run.

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

5 minutes ago, Neech said:

I wonder what value Anderson could fetch on the market.  We have too many RW's and he might be the only one who could return us some positive future assets.  But once again, the crazy term will make it much more difficult to move him.  I think we might find that we're locked into Bergy's unbalanced team for the long run.

 

I like Anderson and what he brings to the team.  I think he is one guy you keep. 

[xXx..CK..xXx]

I’d like to keep Toffoli and hope we do.

[tomh009]

In three years, Toffoli will be 32, and in five years 34. (Gallagher is the same age.) That will surely be a factor as we rebuild.

[xXx..CK..xXx]

Yes, it’s good to have some veterans around as we reorganize. Especially those who are enthusiastic to be around the big hockey city market... à la Toffoli. 

[Habsfan89]

41 minutes ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:

I’d like to keep Toffoli and hope we do.

If it's a full rebuild then blow up the team like they did the front office.

Anderson 

Petry 

Gallagher 

Hoffman 

Drouin 

Price 

Edmundson 

Lehkonen 

Toffoli 

Byron 

Armia 

Chiarot 

Savard 

Kulak 

Allan 

 

Should all be traded 

 

Build the team around Suzuki, Caufield, Dvorak, Romanov, Guhle, Poehling and Evans 

[Neech]

1 hour ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

I like Anderson and what he brings to the team.  I think he is one guy you keep. 

I wouldn't trade him unless we get a lottery pick or top prospect coming back.  But I don't think his game will age well, and he has an extensive injury history. 

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

dlbalr could well be right about Gallagher, but NHL GMs are not always the most rational of calculators. Gallagher has a sterling rep as a blood-and-guts guys who brings it every shift. I can see some old-school GM being willing to cough up something meaningful for Gally IF he is healthy at the right time. I sure hope so, because that contract is going to get worse every day for the next five years.

 

Anyway, while Habsfan89’s proposal to trade everyone is obviously nuts, he is right that ANYONE should be on the table. The point will be to maximize return. To my mind, Petry could be a really high-value target, but not with 2 points in 26 games, FFS. If he were performing at anything resembling his normal level - if he were even 1/2 of what he normally is - he could command a king’s ransom at the deadline. But just our luck, he has been a total disaster. It might be better to wait until next season, see if he can bounce back, and then trade him.

 

Anyway, much as I might wish for Gally and Petry to bring back the kind of return we could have gotten for them as late as last year, Toffoli, Hoffman, and Chiarot, to my mind, are the most realistic candidates to bring back meaningful assets.

 

I wouldn’t rule out Armia being of disproportionate interest as well. I notice the colour commentators have a lot of respect for Armia - a clue to how old-school plodders tend to think. Not saying he’ll bring back an elite prospect, just that the return on him might be higher than we’d think off the top of our heads.

[PMAC]

I don't know about "everyone on the table" but at this point I'm open to anyone being traded as long as the return is excellent. Here is are my lists of where I think the players should be categorized by the new regime-- but of course, since I can't read Gorton's mind, except for the obvious "What the F@@K have I gotten myself into!" I don't expect him to agree with me. And, or course I am aware that Carey Price controls his own destiny and may refuse to be traded. Only player whose category I am unsure of is Dvorak...I originally had him in the "Keep" category as our centre depth is so abysmal. Obviously, I don't think tearing the whole thing down and jettisoning contracts while retaining salary is the way to go. 

 

Keep

Suzuki

Romanov

Caufield

Evans

Edmunston

Lehkonen

Poelhing

Clague

Ylonen

Anderson

Youppi

 

Trade

Chiarot

Armia

Byron

Paquette

Perrault

Nicu

Penzetta

Kulak

Wideman

Montembault ( not sure who would trade for him but if you could get a 7th, go for it)

Dauphin (ditto) 

 

Trade if return is reasonable (ie., a real asset(s) with minimal salary retention or multiple assets with significant retention)

Drouin

Price

Petry

Toffoli

Hoffman

Gallagher

Dvorak

Allen

Savard

 

[DON]

Could we get a 1st for this guy? All options should be on the table as you say.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

13 minutes ago, DON said:

Could we get a 1st for this guy? All options should be on the table as you say.

 

Sorry, Jim Benning is no longer an NHL GM, so it’s not happening

[alfredoh2009]

Posting here from other thread (with some edits):

On 12/4/2021 at 3:33 PM, alfredoh2009 said:

My $0.02 's worth:

Trade Hoffman, Petry, Chiarot, Wideman, Armia, Byron, Montembault for:

(in order of priority)

1. one NHL top-4 RD

2.one young goalie prospect to develop behind than Primeau (with more waiver exemption eligibility )

3. as many high draft picks (Rounds 1 and 2) as possible in 2022 and 2023

 

I would keep both Gallagher's and Price's bad contracts, unless they want to get a chance to win a cup or another team makes an offer that can NOT be refused.

I would keep inconsistent players like Drouin, Dvorak, Lehkonen because they are good complementary players

 

Finally, I would develop from the D forward, focusing in mobile, physical defensemen: Edmundson-Savard would be my minute-eating pair until the new top-4 D is drafted/developed and ready to make the team a force to be reckon with.

 

2022-2023 NHL team:

Anderson-Suzuki-Caufield

Drouin-Dvorak-Gallagher
Lehkonen-Poehling-Ylonen

Pezzetta-Evans-(NEW_GRINDER)

           
Edmundson-Savard
Romanov-(NEW_TOP4_RD)

Kulak-Clague

Niku
            
Price/Allen

[tomh009]

34 minutes ago, PMAC said:

I don't know about "everyone on the table" but at this point I'm open to anyone being traded as long as the return is excellent. Here is are my lists of where I think the players should be categorized by the new regime-- but of course, since I can't read Gorton's mind, except for the obvious "What the F@@K have I gotten myself into!" I don't expect him to agree with me. And, or course I am aware that Carey Price controls his own destiny and may refuse to be traded. Only player whose category I am unsure of is Dvorak...I originally had him in the "Keep" category as our centre depth is so abysmal. Obviously, I don't thing tearing the whole thing down and jettisoning contracts while retaining salary is the way to go. 

 

Keep

Suzuki

Romanov

Caufield

Evans

Edmunston

Lehkonen

Poelhing

Clague

Ylonen

Anderson

 

Trade

Chiarot

Armia

Byron

Paquette

Perrault

Nicu

Penzetta

Kulak

Wideman

Montembault ( not sure who would trade for him but if you could get a 7th, go for it)

Dauphin (ditto) 

 

Trade if return is reasonable (ie., a real asset(s) with minimal salary retention or multiple assets with significant retention)

Drouin

Price

Petry

Toffoli

Hoffman

Gallagher

Dvorak

Allen

 

We should keep either Montembeault or Allen, not going to find anyone cheaper anyway.

 

And Niku, if we're going to have a more mobile defence in the future, keeping a young puck-moving D would make sense to me. If we end up with a surplus of good young D later (because enough of our D prospects worked out), we can always trade him at that point.

 

Of course, I don't know what Gorton's strategy will be for D.

[titanfan]

1 hour ago, PMAC said:

I don't know about "everyone on the table" but at this point I'm open to anyone being traded as long as the return is excellent. Here is are my lists of where I think the players should be categorized by the new regime-- but of course, since I can't read Gorton's mind, except for the obvious "What the F@@K have I gotten myself into!" I don't expect him to agree with me. And, or course I am aware that Carey Price controls his own destiny and may refuse to be traded. Only player whose category I am unsure of is Dvorak...I originally had him in the "Keep" category as our centre depth is so abysmal. Obviously, I don't thing tearing the whole thing down and jettisoning contracts while retaining salary is the way to go. 

 

Keep

Suzuki

Romanov

Caufield

Evans

Edmunston

Lehkonen

Poelhing

Clague

Ylonen

Anderson

 

Trade

Chiarot

Armia

Byron

Paquette

Perrault

Nicu

Penzetta

Kulak

Wideman

Montembault ( not sure who would trade for him but if you could get a 7th, go for it)

Dauphin (ditto) 

 

Trade if return is reasonable (ie., a real asset(s) with minimal salary retention or multiple assets with significant retention)

Drouin

Price

Petry

Toffoli

Hoffman

Gallagher

Dvorak

Allen

 

Hard to disagree with most of that.

 

I'd keep Byron and Perreault though. 

 

Perreault's team friendly contract (assuming we keep him for $1 million or less) gives us a versatile forward moving forward for minimal cost.  He looks like a guy who would like to finish his career in Montreal, and may just find an extra gear in front of a home town crowd - assuming his eye injury is behind him.

 

As for Byron, I think he is more valuable to us that the return we would get.  His obvious leadership, speed on his skates and penalty killing alone are all valuable tools.  They just don't show up on the scoresheet.  Another 20-goal season would be a bonus!

 

Honestly, I think we put too much focus on goals and assists to evaluate players.  Obviously it would be nice to have guys who can do that (although we haven't had a real goal scorer in a long time...), but a team needs players who can fill multiple roles.  Byron and Perreault both do that....

 

Hoffman and Dvorak, for example, were brought here to score.   If they can't do that....then time to move on.... 

 

[dlbalr]

2 hours ago, DON said:

Could we get a 1st for this guy? All options should be on the table as you say.

 

No, Youppi! stays.  You don't just get rid of a Hall of Fame mascot (yes, there really is a Mascot Hall of Fame) when things are going tough.

[PMAC]

I edited my list to add Youppi to the “keep” list😎

[hockeyrealist]

11 hours ago, titanfan said:

Hard to disagree with most of that.

 

I'd keep Byron and Perreault though. 

 

Perreault's team friendly contract (assuming we keep him for $1 million or less) gives us a versatile forward moving forward for minimal cost.  He looks like a guy who would like to finish his career in Montreal, and may just find an extra gear in front of a home town crowd - assuming his eye injury is behind him.

 

As for Byron, I think he is more valuable to us that the return we would get.  His obvious leadership, speed on his skates and penalty killing alone are all valuable tools.  They just don't show up on the scoresheet.  Another 20-goal season would be a bonus!

 

Honestly, I think we put too much focus on goals and assists to evaluate players.  Obviously it would be nice to have guys who can do that (although we haven't had a real goal scorer in a long time...), but a team needs players who can fill multiple roles.  Byron and Perreault both do that....

 

Hoffman and Dvorak, for example, were brought here to score.   If they can't do that....then time to move on.... 

 

Dvorak was not brought in to score, he’s a two way centre that wins draws.  At least that is what he was brought in for.

I believe expectations of 40 ish points as well, but not really expected to light it up.

[Habsfan89]

Here's a question if the plan is to still try and win a cup with this group of guys, with this year just being a right off year. then if we get a top 5 pick do you trade it for an elite established center or LD/RD to win now? Or do you make the pick🤔