2023 NHL Entry Draft

[Dalhabs]

4 minutes ago, dlbalr said:

 

With Arizona going way off the board to get Simashev, it's pretty clear that Reinbacher wasn't going to be there if they traded down.  Evidently, they preferred foregoing the extra compensation of a trade down (if one was still there, I suspect it was) and someone they felt was a lesser player.

 

I don't mind the pick.  To me, he's the piece that perfectly completes Montreal's defensive puzzle.  On the right side, Barron is more of a second-pairing guy and Mailloux's defensive struggles might limit him to a third-pairing spot.  Reinbacher is a future 20+ minute top-pairing piece that can log tough minutes shorthanded and at five-on-five.  (I went with 20 as an ATOI as I'm not sure he fits as a primary PP option with the current prospect pool.)  Those players are hard to come by.

 

Some quick scouting reports: https://www.habsworld.net/2023/06/habs-select-david-reinbacher-5th-overall/

The NL League is very strong. Lots of former khl-stars went there after Russias war. Getting 22 points as an 18-yearold very good numbers. I just wanted one of the remaining forwards so much. 😁

[GHT120]

2 minutes ago, Sir_Boagalott said:

Well, its no rumor that the Wings and Flyers had top 10 and top 20 picks.  Those picks might fall near where Dvorsky and Sand Covered Pelican are drafted.  So far, they could have got Dvorsky with either of those top 10 picks, and been closer to the BPA at those spots.  

 

But we will not know WHAT they were willing to offer.

And who is the Sand Covered Pelican?

[dlbalr]

Just now, GHT120 said:

And who is the Sand Covered pelican?

 

Axel Sandin-Pellikka.

[GHT120]

Just now, dlbalr said:

Axel Sandin-Pellikka.

 

Merci

[Sir_Boagalott]

2 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

But we will not know WHAT they were willing to offer.

And who is the Sand Covered Pelican?

 

You honestly dont know that I am referring to Sandin-Pellika?

[GHT120]

2 minutes ago, Sir_Boagalott said:

You honestly dont know that I am referring to Sandin-Pellika?

 

No ... and I am appropriately ashamed
🙄

[tomh009]

Benson all the way down in 13th.

[alfredoh2009]

On 6/19/2023 at 9:51 AM, alfredoh2009 said:

Reinbacher, RHD eh?!

I would trade down to get him, dump salary and get another pick in the draft

 

 

Not bad, not bad at all.

 

I am happy with this pick

[IN THE HEARTS OF MEN]

A Dman goes in top 5 for the last million years.. should of bet the house the Habs wouldn't buck the trend

 

 

 

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

31 minutes ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:

I am not saying I am the best scout out there but I do watch international junior hockey religiously and I personally pair players like Caufield, Subban and Price together because they were players who performed internationally at the junior level prior to the draft. Caufield also broke a lot of scoring records as a junior that made me confident about his transition to the big leagues.

 

I understand that the Price pick was not the most popular choice at the time. Around that time, I myself would have liked taking someone like Kopitar, although I didn’t hate the Price choice. With that being said, while it is indeed a small sample size, him and Jonathan Toews both had extremely memorable moments at the junior level; particularly that shootout versus the United States where Price made multiple key saves and Toews scored multiple goals. Price went 5th and Toews 3rd. He also won championships.

 

Subban isn’t comparable as he went in the second round but I also saw special things from him as a junior that I was excited to see translate to the NHL level.

 

I haven’t watched Reinbacher as much as I watched those players so I don’t have much footing to stand on, but his statistics do not exactly yell out “stud first pairing defenseman”.  
 

I am hopeful for Slafkovsky and he had some great junior moments as well but I did not have the same emotion with he or KK as I did with Price, Caufield and Subban in recent memory. I feel the same way with Reinbacher. Felt differently with Price.

 

I will always route for every one of our players so I am cheering Reinbacher on. I also agree that when it comes to the drafts, outside of the top pick or two, and even them, it is such a crap shoot because there will be many unforseen factors that come into play. As a result, none of us know what we are talking about in the present. 

 

I can still say publically that I expect better things from Michkov than Reinbacher, even though I do know nothing.

 

I respect everything you say. And I agree that a reasonably informed person could look at this pick and be unsettled by a pick that seems to be positional rather than BPA, in a year full of elite talent. On the other hand, let’s face it, you are basically setting yourself up here as a superior talent evaluator to the habs’ scouting staff, Hughes, and Gorton. 

 

Then there are all the denunciations that they didn’t move down - as though we are privy to what trade options were actually on the table, or deny that Arizona wanted the kid.

 

Word like “disaster” and “gut wrenching” are being used to describe this pick. That seems out of all proportion to me. The Habs took an unexpected turn with Slaf and now with this kid. We don’t know yet whether our group has superior draft acumen, or is just outsmarting itself. Concern is a reasonable reaction. Lamentations and anger seem unreasonable. Again, I remember Price and the rage and dismay that shook Habs land when his name was called. It is simply too soon for such strong reactions IMHO.

 

 

[Sir_Boagalott]

If the Flames don't take Sandin-Pellikka the Habs could have had him and Dvorsky - if the rumors of Flyers and Wings were willing to trade both their picks to move up to 5th.

[GHT120]

2 minutes ago, Sir_Boagalott said:

If the Flames don't take Sandin-Pellikka the Habs could have had him and Dvorsky - if the rumors of Flyers and Wings were willing to trade both their picks to move up to 5th.

If you can keep your head when all about you   
    Are losing theirs and blaming it on you,   
If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you,
    But make allowance for their doubting too;   
If you can wait and not be tired by waiting,
    Or being lied about, don’t deal in lies,
Or being hated, don’t give way to hating,
    And yet don’t look too good, nor talk too wise:

If you can dream—and not make dreams your master;   
    If you can think—and not make thoughts your aim;   
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
    And treat those two impostors just the same;   
If you can bear to hear the truth you’ve spoken
    Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
Or watch the things you gave your life to, broken,
    And stoop and build ’em up with worn-out tools:

If you can make one heap of all your winnings
    And risk it on one turn of pitch-and-toss,
And lose, and start again at your beginnings
    And never breathe a word about your loss;
If you can force your heart and nerve and sinew
    To serve your turn long after they are gone,   
And so hold on when there is nothing in you
    Except the Will which says to them: ‘Hold on!’

If you can talk with crowds and keep your virtue,   
    Or walk with Kings—nor lose the common touch,
If neither foes nor loving friends can hurt you,
    If all men count with you, but none too much;
If you can fill the unforgiving minute
    With sixty seconds’ worth of distance run,   
Yours is the Earth and everything that’s in it,   
    And—which is more—you’ll be a Man, my son!

[Peter Puck]

The biggest rumour was that Washington was willing to trade up.  I think its pretty clear now that this was false.  Based upon the picks teams made I don't think any team was motivated to trade up to number 5.

 

[GHT120]

6 minutes ago, Peter Puck said:

The biggest rumour was that Washington was willing to trade up.  I think its pretty clear now that this was false.  Based upon the picks teams made I don't think any team was motivated to trade up to number 5.

 

I think teams wanted to trade up ... but offered nowhere near what was rumoured.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

Just now, GHT120 said:

I think teams wanted to trade up ... but offered nowhere near what was rumoured.

 

There is always a lot of hype, hysteria, and smoke and mirrors around the draft. The mistake is in taking it all too literally.

[Sir_Boagalott]

1 minute ago, GHT120 said:

7 minutes ago, Peter Puck said:

The biggest rumour was that Washington was willing to trade up.  I think its pretty clear now that this was false.  Based upon the picks teams made I don't think any team was motivated to trade up to number 5.

 

I think teams wanted to trade up ... but offered nowhere near what was rumoured.

 

I don't believe the rumors were false either.  I think its more like the Habs gave the Avs a pick that might have been needed to make the trade.  ex:  Wings or Flyers top 10 pick and their top 20 for the Habs 5th and 32nd or 37th.  

[Peter Puck]

1 minute ago, Sir_Boagalott said:

 

I don't believe the rumors were false either.  I think its more like the Habs gave the Avs a pick that might have been needed to make the trade.  ex:  Wings or Flyers top 10 pick and their top 20 for the Habs 5th and 32nd or 37th.  

If Washington or Philly or one of the other with a pick in the 6-12 range teams wanted Michkov or someone else the lack of the 31st pick would not  have prevented them.  Either of those teams could have made a deal with Arizona who have plenty of picks. 

[GHT120]

5 minutes ago, Peter Puck said:

If Washington or Philly or one of the other with a pick in the 6-12 range teams wanted Michkov or someone else the lack of the 31st pick would not  have prevented them.  Either of those teams could have made a deal with Arizona who have plenty of picks. 

They *** MAY *** have tried to exploit what they thought would be a PR-problem for Hughes in passing on Michkov and low-ball them ... now they have proof that Hughes will do what *** he *** believes is right for the Habs, regardless.

[Sir_Boagalott]

2 minutes ago, Peter Puck said:

If Washington or Philly or one of the other with a pick in the 6-12 range teams wanted Michkov or someone else the lack of the 31st pick would not  have prevented them.  Either of those teams could have made a deal with Arizona who have plenty of picks. 

8 minutes ago, Sir_Boagalott said:

17 minutes ago, Peter Puck said:

 Based upon the picks teams made I don't think any team was motivated to trade up to number 5.

 

What you said, but down.  Clearly, it is unarguable that the Yotes were picking a dman - and Reinbacher is the top dman in the draft.  

 

Wanting Michkov and doing anything to get him are not the same thing.  The Flyers needed both their 1st rnd picks and the Wings being unwilling to give up both of theirs for Michkov is not proof they were not interested in him.

 

 

 

 

[GHT120]

4 minutes ago, Sir_Boagalott said:

What you said, but down.  Clearly, it is unarguable that the Yotes were picking a dman - and Reinbacher is the top dman in the draft.  

 

Wanting Michkov and doing anything to get him are not the same thing.  The Flyers needed both their 1st rnd picks and the Wings being unwilling to give up both of theirs for Michkov is not proof they were not interested in him.

 

Think Peter was (a) responding to a specific suggestion that the absence of 31 and/or 37 was what prevented a trade ... and ... (b) just saying other teams didn't want iMchkov enough to give up what it would take to interest Hughes, not that they weren't interested in Michkov.

[Peter Puck]

1 minute ago, GHT120 said:

Think Peter was (a) responding to a specific suggestion that the absence of 31 and/or 37 was what prevented a trade ... and ... (b) just saying other teams didn't want iMchkov enough to give up what it would take to interest Hughes, not that they weren't interested in Michkov.

Exactly.

 

  Some people are complaining we didn't trade back.  I think it very unlikely any tempting packages were offered for the 5th (or 6th) pick.  

[Neech]

Well we have our D corps set up for the future. Hopefully there are at least 3-4 stars among them. Building from the net out can make us a longterm contender, like the Canes for instance. I'll admit I'd have been more excited with Michkov, but who knows who'll be the better player down the line. The armchair experts freaking out over this are a bit much, but hey that's what fandom's all about. 

[xXx..CK..xXx]

57 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

I respect everything you say. And I agree that a reasonably informed person could look at this pick and be unsettled by a pick that seems to be positional rather than BPA, in a year full of elite talent. On the other hand, let’s face it, you are basically setting yourself up here as a superior talent evaluator to the habs’ scouting staff, Hughes, and Gorton. 

 

Then there are all the denunciations that they didn’t move down - as though we are privy to what trade options were actually on the table, or deny that Arizona wanted the kid.

 

Word like “disaster” and “gut wrenching” are being used to describe this pick. That seems out of all proportion to me. The Habs took an unexpected turn with Slaf and now with this kid. We don’t know yet whether our group has superior draft acumen, or is just outsmarting itself. Concern is a reasonable reaction. Lamentations and anger seem unreasonable. Again, I remember Price and the rage and dismay that shook Habs land when his name was called. It is simply too soon for such strong reactions IMHO.

 

 

 

My main point though admittedly overblown is that the reaction to this pick should not be compared to the Price pick, outside of the fact that it was 5th overall.

 

Price demonstrated much more as a junior than Reinbacher and therefore while people  may have overreacted to the Price pick, I don’t see negative comments in this case as being similar to the other case. Price will have been superior to Reinbacher by the end of their careers and it was something that I think could be seen early. As I stated many times in my other post, I do know nothing because it is impossible to predict what will happen with 100% certainty. With that being said, I feel confident enough in this thought to make it public without fear of it being incorrect in the longterm. 
 

I personally do not think of this pick as “gut wrenching” nor being a “disaster” but I also don’t think we’ll have had the steal of the draft when all is said and done, like Carey Price.

 

Secondly, I believe that if you think I am setting myself to be a superior scouting talent than Hughes and Gorton, then you are misinterpreting my previous post. I do not see myself as a superior scout to the Habs management. In fact, that is the opposite of what I said.

 

There can be reasons why my thoughts differ from theirs without being superior. It is not hard to imagine that the organization has “higher standards” or “morals” (Russian factor) which they take into consideration that a typical fan like myself won’t care about. Perhaps they don’t want to risk Michkov’s contract situation, etc. whereas a regular fan like myself wouldn’t care about that when compared to the thought of his potential. 

 

I wanted Michkov but knew the Habs would not pick him because any of the risks that I mentioned in the last paragraph. They care about the organization’s image, values, and culture more than a fan would.
 

It’s also easy to state that current management are superior to a fan because they should be, however I have had similar situations in the past where people disagree with an opinion of mine like this, and it turns out to be right. 

On the other hand, this is a draft of kids and so only time will tell. I wanted Zadina (or Tkachuk who was hated by many) instead of KK. I can admit Zadina would not have been a great pick and I thought he would be so I look forward to seeing how this plays out and hopefully Reinbacher does turn out to be a stud, even if I personally have my doubts. 

[hab29RETIRED]

1 hour ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

I respect everything you say. And I agree that a reasonably informed person could look at this pick and be unsettled by a pick that seems to be positional rather than BPA, in a year full of elite talent. On the other hand, let’s face it, you are basically setting yourself up here as a superior talent evaluator to the habs’ scouting staff, Hughes, and Gorton. 

 

Then there are all the denunciations that they didn’t move down - as though we are privy to what trade options were actually on the table, or deny that Arizona wanted the kid.

 

Word like “disaster” and “gut wrenching” are being used to describe this pick. That seems out of all proportion to me. The Habs took an unexpected turn with Slaf and now with this kid. We don’t know yet whether our group has superior draft acumen, or is just outsmarting itself. Concern is a reasonable reaction. Lamentations and anger seem unreasonable. Again, I remember Price and the rage and dismay that shook Habs land when his name was called. It is simply too soon for such strong reactions IMHO.

 

 

I’m no draft expert. And don’t claim to be one. But when you read how forward heavy this draft is, how elite the top 6-7 forwards are, and how they are all arguably better than Slafkovsky, it’s hard to accept taking a dman - even though we need a RH dman. Particularly since the dmen this year are supposed to the weakest of any recent draft class.

 

I hate seeing us passing on Michkov (despite the Russian factor), or Leonard, and have them both go to eastern teams.

 

if we try bringing this kid up this year I will seriously lose it!!!

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

Admittedly I was surprised by this pick, perhaps not a sexy pick but I also know that stud RHD are hard to come by, no one is trading them away. I am no pro  scout so will trust the scouting department on this one.  Who thought Simashev would go at 6??  Likely no one.