Permanent Rumour Thread

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

Another loss for the Oilers, the desperation increases. 

[BCHabnut]

Do people want Monty traded? I'm not so sure I approve. 

[TurdBurglar]

3 minutes ago, BCHabnut said:

Do people want Monty traded? I'm not so sure I approve. 

It all depends on the return.  I would rather Allen be traded, but I think Primeau's value is too low and Allen's contract is too high to be traded this early.  Someone has to go. 

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

20 minutes ago, TurdBurglar said:

It all depends on the return.  I would rather Allen be traded, but I think Primeau's value is too low and Allen's contract is too high to be traded this early.  Someone has to go. 

 

Agreed, I would think Monty is the goalie teams would be interested in for the reasons you mentioned. His contract can be easily absorbed. Depends on the return. 

[DON]

9 hours ago, BCHabnut said:

Do people want Monty traded? I'm not so sure I approve. 

I am not fussy, 1 goalie needs to be moved, or waive Primeau, sucks he cant go to Laval without waivers but is what it is.

 

https://edmontonjournal.com/sports/hockey/nhl/cult-of-hockey/edmonton-oilers-and-montreal-canadiens-working-on-a-blockbuster-trade-nhl-insider-digs-in

[Helmethead]

You’re not moving Montembault because you’re maximizing theoretical asset value. 
 

You’re trading Montembault because he’s a wanted asset on an expiring contract. 
 

While signing him would add stability to the back end, signing him for a contract that is either too long or too rich means you run the risk of turning that asset into a liability. 
 

The reason why I am a proponent of moving him is because it has become blatantly obvious that mid tier goalies have very little value on the trade market. 
 

In Edmonton, we have a willing dance partner that not only has a perceived goalie issue but also a cap issue. 
 

If we Hughes can finagle a move that on the surface solves both those issues for Edmonton then you best be certain he will extract full value for doing so. 
 

And if that means losing Monty then so be it. 
 

Goalies are voodoo after all aren’t they?

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

15 minutes ago, Helmethead said:

You’re not moving Montembault because you’re maximizing theoretical asset value. 
 

You’re trading Montembault because he’s a wanted asset on an expiring contract. 
 

While signing him would add stability to the back end, signing him for a contract that is either too long or too rich means you run the risk of turning that asset into a liability. 
 

The reason why I am a proponent of moving him is because it has become blatantly obvious that mid tier goalies have very little value on the trade market. 
 

In Edmonton, we have a willing dance partner that not only has a perceived goalie issue but also a cap issue. 
 

If we Hughes can finagle a move that on the surface solves both those issues for Edmonton then you best be certain he will extract full value for doing so. 
 

And if that means losing Monty then so be it. 
 

Goalies are voodoo after all aren’t they?

 

Good post. The expiring contract thing would be the key.

 

As Commandant has pointed out, the “voodoo” thing cuts both ways. From the moment he arrived I said he made me think of Jakob Markstrom. I don’t think he will ever get as good as Markstrom was at his peak BUT late-blooming goalies can actually be a thing. If Monty puts together three or four impact seasons while we flounder around for lack of a goalie, we’ll regret that trade.

 

All that being said, I am OK with trading him, knowing that this is (IMHO) a realistic risk, if we get a major return for him. You have to take calculated risks if you want to build a contender. I’ve said before that I don’t see the young talent at FW sufficient to make us contend. This trade could be one avenue to mitigating that concern.

[tomh009]

2 hours ago, Helmethead said:

While signing him would add stability to the back end, signing him for a contract that is either too long or too rich means you run the risk of turning that asset into a liability. 

(...)

In Edmonton, we have a willing dance partner that not only has a perceived goalie issue but also a cap issue.

We don't know what Montembeault's asking price is, or what Hughes is willing to pay, or what the current gap is (Hughes knows, but he's not talking). Too long or too rich? Close to signing or not? We don't know.

 

But beyond the untouchables, Edmonton has little to offer in terms of either young players, prospects or picks in any case, and most players have NTC/NMC so cannot be traded. On top of that, the Oilers are approaching a point where it's too late to salvage this season anyway. So, it sure doesn't look like there is a trade realistically possible with them.

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

8 minutes ago, tomh009 said:

We don't know what Montembeault's asking price is, or what Hughes is willing to pay, or what the current gap is (Hughes knows, but he's not talking). Too long or too rich? Close to signing or not? We don't know.

 

But beyond the untouchables, Edmonton has little to offer in terms of either young players, prospects or picks in any case, and most players have NTC/NMC so cannot be traded. On top of that, the Oilers are approaching a point where it's too late to salvage this season anyway. So, it sure doesn't look like there is a trade realistically possible with them.

 

There is zero chance the Oilers give up on the season, 10 points out of a wild card spot with 64 games left, very doable if they can turn things around.  As mentioned in another post, Holloway is the guy I would target.  I think there is a deal there. 

[DON]

1 minute ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

There is zero chance the Oilers give up on the season, 10 points out of a wild card spot with 64 games left, very doable if they can turn things around.  As mentioned in another post, Holloway is the guy I would target.  I think there is a deal there. 

4.00 goals against/game and 30th place, seems near time to give up.

[tomh009]

8 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

There is zero chance the Oilers give up on the season, 10 points out of a wild card spot with 64 games left, very doable if they can turn things around.  As mentioned in another post, Holloway is the guy I would target.  I think there is a deal there. 

That's a big if. 10 points doesn't sound like much, but they only have a grand total of 11 points out of their 18 games so far.

 

I don't know whether there will be a deal, but my personal view is that it would be very difficult to come up with a deal that works for both teams.

[Helmethead]

Now anyone know what the hell is happening in Chicago with Perry??

 

They're being cryptic AF. 
 

Both he and Mrazek missed practice today. 
 

Trades can’t be announced due to thanksgiving right?

 

That reeks of Edmonton. 

[GHT120]

12 minutes ago, Helmethead said:

Now anyone know what the hell is happening in Chicago with Perry??

 

They're being cryptic AF. 
 

Both he and Mrazek missed practice today. 
 

Trades can’t be announced due to thanksgiving right?

 

That reeks of Edmonton. 

 

I doubt US Thanksgiving is reason not to announce trades ... besides, Perry has a $4M contract ... even with retention $2M would mean a complex series of moves to make it fit ... and what does Edmonton offer to both compensate for Perry AND for the retention? ... for a player who is a 4th liner on a good team.

 

I would expect it is something of a personal nature ...
<< PERHAPS >>> illness or a death in the family.

[Prime Minister Koivu]

19 minutes ago, Helmethead said:

Now anyone know what the hell is happening in Chicago with Perry??

 

They're being cryptic AF. 
 

Both he and Mrazek missed practice today. 
 

Trades can’t be announced due to thanksgiving right?

 

That reeks of Edmonton. 

 

 

9 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

 

I doubt US Thanksgiving is reason not to announce trades ... besides, Perry has a $4M contract ... even with retention $2M would mean a complex series of moves to make it fit ... and what does Edmonton offer to both compensate for Perry AND for the retention? ... for a player who is a 4th liner on a good team.

 

I would expect it is something of a personal nature ...
<< PERHAPS >>> illness or a death in the family.

 

Mrazek and Perry for Campbell and ??? + ????

 

Sure does seem suspicious but Mrazek is quite a gamble to put the Oilers hope on. 

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

1 hour ago, DON said:

4.00 goals against/game and 30th place, seems near time to give up.

 

Hardly, the St. Louis Blues were in last place on Jan 3rd, 2019.  Guess who won the cup that year???

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

1 hour ago, tomh009 said:

That's a big if. 10 points doesn't sound like much, but they only have a grand total of 11 points out of their 18 games so far.

 

I don't know whether there will be a deal, but my personal view is that it would be very difficult to come up with a deal that works for both teams.

 

I agree that deals are difficult to make but 10 points is hardly insurmountable this early in the year. 

[DON]

1 minute ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

Hardly, the St. Louis Blues were in last place on Jan 3rd, 2019.  Guess who won the cup that year???

Your joking I assume.

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

4 minutes ago, DON said:

Your joking I assume.

 

I am not joking, just illustrating that's its far too early for the Oilers to give up by giving an example of a team that was in last place far later in the year and recovered to not only make the playoffs but win the cup. 

[DON]

32 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

I am not joking, just illustrating that's its far too early for the Oilers to give up by giving an example of a team that was in last place far later in the year and recovered to not only make the playoffs but win the cup. 

I think they are toast and is best (smartest) for them to look to future and rebuild. 

[BCHabnut]

2 minutes ago, DON said:

I think they are toast and is best (smartest) for them to look to future and rebuild. 

Hahaha.  Just love stirring the pot, don't you? Love it.

[hab29RETIRED]

57 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

I am not joking, just illustrating that's its far too early for the Oilers to give up by giving an example of a team that was in last place far later in the year and recovered to not only make the playoffs but win the cup. 

There is a difference. The blues had strong defence, good offense (well balanced, albeit not having the elite high level stars Edmonton has), and Binnington emerged. In the Blues case, a coaching change was the necessary move. With Edmonton, they need to get a goalie AND significantly upgrade their D. Coaching was not really their big Achilles heel and a coaching change isn’t going to fix those holes. They are also capped out, so not sure they can make the changes they need.

 

the oilers are not just a team underperforming. They are a poorly built team, and use an over haul outside of Draisaitl, McDavid and Ekholm. 

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

4 minutes ago, hab29RETIRED said:

There is a difference. The blues had strong defence, good offense (well balanced, albeit not having the elite high level stars Edmonton has), and Binnington emerged. In the Blues case, a coaching change was the necessary move. With Edmonton, they need to get a goalie AND significantly upgrade their D. Coaching was not really their big Achilles heel and a coaching change isn’t going to fix those holes. They are also capped out, so not sure they can make the changes they need.

 

Another difference is the Oilers have an extra 6 weeks than the Blues did. The Oilers defense was good enough to get to the Stanley Cup semi final but now they are terrible? The Oilers do need better goaltending.  Maybe somebody will emerge like Binnington did.  The Oilers have some challenges for sure, just saying it's far too early to count them out. 

[Sir_Boagalott]

2 hours ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

There is zero chance the Oilers give up on the season, 10 points out of a wild card spot with 64 games left, very doable if they can turn things around.  As mentioned in another post, Holloway is the guy I would target.  I think there is a deal there. 

 

I fully agree with you on that and I'd add the Oils are even better off because they are 3 games behind the Kraken so they are only 2 games back of 8th place vs 5 games.   They are 5 games out of 7th place and with the # of games remaining that is still doable for them.  What seems improbable at this point is the Oils being 3rd in their div being 7 games back but LA has been hot lately and they will likely cool off a bit.  There are enough games left that even 3rd place could be possible for them.  

 

Regarding the Blues, I believe they won because they were 1 of the toughest most physical teams in the payoffs that year.  Their goaltending was also a big part of it.  

[alfredoh2009]

20 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

[...]

By this logic

[...]

Hi Chicoutimi Cucumber, I am replying to your post on the "By this logic" reply, but this is more to all that commented on my posts.

My thinking is that prospects may be managed like a stock portfolio where you pickup as many assets considering the projected value that player may gain by the time he is ready to join the NHL roster. Of course, present value and current success is no warrant of future fit to the team's needs.

Sometimes, teams may pickup the "best player available", sometimes they may pick based on "team needs", and sometimes they may take a "safe pick". or: "bluechip", "portolio-balancing" and "value" picks.

 

In the case of a Kutcherov or Joshua Roy, those picks raised in value beyond expectations and need to be evaluated with regard to how they improve the NHL roster once they are part of it. In both cases, the cost spent on the pick (rank in draft) is much lower than what may be expected for the performance of players.

 

In the case of Montembeault, the cost was "nil", and each of the wins he has provide to the team add to his value to the team. A decision needs to be made on how to best use that value and if it is better to sell high or to wait for him to turn into Budaj.

 

That is my logic.

 

===

As for the proposed trade, I supported the person who posted the proposal as a trade I would make if the return helps the Habs get closer to winning a cup. But I have stated multiple times that my preference is to trade Allen even if it is for Camnpbell and some token prospect or pick.

 

[Commandant]

1 hour ago, DON said:

I think they are toast and is best (smartest) for them to look to future and rebuild. 

 

The Oilers are not going to give up on a season in November with a healthy McDavid and Draisaitl in their lineup, and needing to re-sign both in the near future.  Giving up on the season now means you will be trading both of those players before they leave in free agency. This is a consideration that goes beyond the numbers.